Wednesday, February 6, 2008

Super delegates can steal nomination from Obama!

Date 02/06/08 By Terry Bankert

Posted full article first to Flint Talk THEN summarized, for discussion, also posted to:
Full article at Google blog Good Morning Flint, with citations. also posted to MLIVE Flint JOURNAL Flint Community blogs, Flint Citizen, Craigs list, Face Book, My Space and . Please circulate and post freely. Do you have suggestions for other sites to post to. Recent BANKERT VLOGG on :Mediation #1 ________


The super delgates and one lone Georgia voter will determine the Democratic presidential nominee. Go Georgia.[trb]

It’s called the Democratic Party, but one aspect of the party’s nominating process is at odds with grass-roots democracy. [msnbc]

I predict grass roots democrats will want Obama, the super slickster delegate will steal the nomination for Clinton.[trb]

In 2008 Hillary Clinton will amass a stockpile of super-delegates, survive disappointing showings in our national grass roots , and go on to win the nomination! [trb]

The super-delegates has the capacity to resist the choice of the overwhelming majority of primary voters and caucus participants![trb]

nomination will still be in doubt at the end of the primary season.[trb]

This has not happened in either party in 30 years.[trb]

The party heavyweights will line up votes at the convention to swing the nomination to Hillary Clinton.[trb] You want reality TV get ready for the national democratic convention, forget American Idol and the Big fat loser back room politcs and its sleazy underpinning will be on front street no place to run no place to hide.[trb]

Voters don’t choose the 842 unpledged "super-delegates" who comprise nearly 40 percent of the number of delegates needed to clinch the Democratic nomination.[msnbc]

Good Morning Flint! Conducted an exclusive interview with a Republican Flint expatriate living in an undisclosed location in Georgia who declared democrat ,voting in this great partys Georgia Super Tuesday.. Stated was " I am voting in the democratic primary for Obama." This was not a love vote for Obama but based on the paridigm; " Hell will freeze over before I sit back and let that ____ in the White House." When we look back this one Georgia voter will have tipped the scales for a democratic victory in 2008. Hillary becasue of this will be our president and Obama our vic President. Thank You Georgia [trb](satiree on the loose)


These super-delegates don’t have superhuman powers, but unlike rank-and-file Democrats, they do automatically get to cast a vote at the convention to decide who the party’s nominee will be.[msnbc]


Although dubbed "unpledged" in Democratic Party lingo, the super-delegates are free to come out before their state’s primary and pledge to support one of the presidential contenders. Msnbc]

The superior delegates will steal the Democratic party preidential nomination from Obama and give it to Clinton.[trb]

Mr. Obama convincingly won Georgia, with exit polls indicating that his support transcended racial lines by an even greater margin than in South Carolina, his earlier Southern primary victory.[TNYT}

Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton won primaries in New York, New Jersey and Arizona and captured the biggest prize of all, California, while Senator Barack Obama strung together nearly a dozen victories from Georgia to Idaho as the two Democratic candidates were locked in an intense struggle for convention delegates on Tuesday.[TNYT]

In Georgia, Mr. Obama had a clear advantage among African-Americans, which powered him to victory. Mrs. Clinton won the white vote, but it wasn't enough to make up for her decisive loss among blacks. In California, she got about two-thirds of the Latino vote. Latinos made up a substantial minority of voters there.[TWSJ]

[Yesterday] -- Super Tuesday -- residents in 24 states and American Samoa [did] vote in the largest single day of balloting in the history of presidential primaries.[LAT]

What the heck is American Samoa?[trb]

American Samoa (
: Amerika S~amoa or S~amoa Amelika) is an unincorporated territory of the United States located in the South Pacific Ocean, southeast of the sovereign state of Samoa. The main (largest and most populous) island is Tutuila, with the Manu#?a Islands, Rose Atoll, and Swains Island also included in the territory. American Samoa is part of the Samoan Islands chain, located west of the Cook Islands, north of Tonga, and some 300 miles (500 km) south of Tokelau. To the west are the islands of the Wallis and Futuna group. The 2000 census showed a total population of 57,291.[1] The total land area is 200.22 km² (77.305 sq mi).[W]


Democratic and Republican candidates have spent days scrambling from California to New York, and in between, racing from tarmac to town hall meeting, staging rallies, conducting satellite interviews, filling the airwaves with ads and stuffing mailboxes with their targeted appeals.[LAT]

Voters in both parties went to the polls yesterday worried about the economy, and in three of the largest states John McCain and Hillary Clinton benefited.[TWSJ}

The goal is simple: to acquire as many delegates as possible. But the distance is vast and the rules for most contests vary, adding layers of complexity to the challenge facing candidates and their strategists.[LAT]

A total of 1,678 pledged delegates were at stake in the 22 state Democratic nominating contests on Tuesday, with 2,025 total delegates needed to win the nomination.[TNYT]

Obama grabbed his home state of Illinois and added Connecticut, Missouri, Colorado, North Dakota, Minnesota, Alabama, Georgia, Idaho, Alaska, Utah, Kansas and Delaware.[?]

Clinton won her home state of New York, along with California, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Arizona, Tennessee, Arkansas and Oklahoma.[SFC]

Why are so many states voting at once?[LAT]

Because politicians and party activists across the country wanted a bigger say in the nominating process. The two major parties set today as the first day most states could schedule their elections without penalty. (Florida, for instance, was stripped of delegates for holding its primary last week.) After California and other big states moved forward, others worried about being overshadowed. So they set their elections for today as well.[LAT]

Michigan was stripped of its delegates in January also for holding an early primary. I bet the super slicksters still have a vote.[trb]

About half of Democratic voters across four large states -- California, New York, Missouri and Georgia -- said the economy was the most important issue facing the country, and voters in the first three of those states favored Sen. Clinton, according to exit polls. The New York senator also won those who picked health care as their top concern.[TWSJ]

Because most states gave nominating delegates to both Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Obama based on vote proportions, as opposed to being winner-take-all contests, the two campaigns were predicting on Tuesday that neither candidate would have a blowout lead, setting up an intensifying race as Louisiana, Washington, Virginia, Ohio and Texas hold nominating contests over the next four weeks.[TNYT]

Both the Clinton and Obama campaign had predicted a close split of the 1,681 delegates awarded, which would leave them both well short of the 2,025 needed to become the nominee.

Is the vote the same for both parties in every state?[LAT]

No. In Kansas, for example, Democrats vote today and Republicans on Saturday. West Virginia Republicans will pick delegates today at a state convention, but Democrats won't vote until May. Some states are holding primaries, others caucuses.[LAT]

Why isn't there more uniformity?[LAT]

Because the two major political parties have no say over how states conduct elections. The parties can use incentives -- like giving or taking away delegates to this summer's national nominating conventions -- to get the states to comply with their wishes. But in the end, states are free to run elections as they choose.[LAT]

The Republican Party in reality is more grass roots when electing a president while the democratic party is elite dominated.[trb]

About half of Democratic voters in all four states said a candidate's ability to bring about change was the most important factor in their decision, and those voters heavily favored Mr. Obama. But Mrs. Clinton took a larger slice of voters who reported other top qualities, including that the candidate cares about people like them and has the right experience.[TWSJ]

Obama is an engorging magnaw chamber about to blow into volcanic eruption at the National Democratic Convention.The reaction to Jeb Bush stealing of a past election by chad fraud will seem like kids play when this nation sees the reaction at the national democratic convention when the nation sees the democratic party supe delegates steal the election Barack Obama![trb]
Do the states decide how delegates are awarded? [LAT]

No, that is decided by the political parties, which also determine who can vote in their primary or caucus. In some states, unaffiliated or "independent" voters can participate, but that varies by party. In California, independents can vote in today's Democratic primary but not the GOP's.[LAT]How do the parties parcel out their delegates?[LAT]

That's where things get really complicated. The Republican system is designed to hasten selection of a nominee so the party can unify behind the front-runner. To that end, the GOP in most states awards delegates on a winner-take-all basis. The formula varies; in some states, such as Arizona and Missouri, all the delegates go to the winner of the statewide popular vote. In other states, like California and Alabama, it is winner-take-all by congressional district, with candidates winning additional delegates for carrying the statewide vote. In a few other states, Alaska and Massachusetts among them, delegates are awarded proportionally based on the overall vote.[LAT]

Democrats tend to worry more about giving different groups a say in the process. So they award their delegates proportionally through a combination of the statewide vote and a candidate's performance in individual congressional districts. Democrats have no winner-take-all states. That means a candidate can lose the popular vote in a state but, by running strongly in certain areas, walk away with a healthy chunk of delegates.[LAT]

How many delegates are at stake today?[LAT]

On the Democratic side, 1,681 pledged delegates are up for grabs in 22 states and American Samoa; it takes 2,025 delegates to secure the Democratic nomination at the party's August convention in Denver. On the Republican side, there will be contests in 21 states with 1,015 pledged delegates at stake; it takes 1,191 to win the nomination at the GOP's September convention in Minneapolis.[LAT]

Who's ahead in delegates so far?[LAT]

According to the Associated Press, Democratic Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York has 261 delegates and Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois has 196. On the Republican side, Sen. John McCain of Arizona has the most delegates, 102, followed by former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney with 93, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee with 43, and Rep. Ron Paul of Texas with four.[LAT]

Exit polls showed black voters overwhelmingly supported Obama, but he also had a small advantage with white men, a group with whom he has previously struggled for votes. Such results would bode well for future races, but the same polling showed he failed to gain significant support from Latinos.[SFC]

Who are the "super delegates" and how do you become one?[LAT]

"One was not to get (ideologically) extreme candidates; the other was to avoid the Jimmy Carter phenomenon — where you had a guy who was not very experienced and not very well regarded by most of his fellow governors, but nevertheless managed to win the party’s nomination," Mayer said.[msnbc]

Super delegates are people automatically granted a vote in the Democratic nominating process by dint of their office, or the political position they once held. Members of Congress and the nation's Democratic governors are super delegates. So are former Presidents Clinton and Carter and former Vice President Al Gore. There are 796 super delegates and they are free to support whomever they choose. The category was created to give the party establishment a say in the selection of the party's nominee.[LAT]

The category includes Democratic governors and members of Congress, former presidents Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter, former vice president Al Gore, retired congressional leaders such as Dick Gephardt, and all Democratic National Committee members, some of whom are appointed by party chairman Howard Dean.[msnbc]

Why did the party adopt this partly undemocratic system? [msnbc]
Super-delegates were supposed to supply some Establishment stability to the nominating process.

Before 1972, party elders, such as Chicago Mayor Richard Daley and Charlie Buckley, the boss of The Bronx who helped John Kennedy clinch the 1960 nomination, wielded inordinate power.[msnbc]

But in early 1970’s, the party’s rules were reformed to open the process to grass-roots activists, women, and ethnic minorities. [msnbc]

Sen. George McGovern, the leading anti-Vietnam war liberal, won the 1972 nomination. McGovern turned out to be a disaster as a presidential candidate, winning only one state and the District of Columbia.[msnbc]

So without reverting to the days of party bosses like Buckley, the Democrats decided to guarantee that elected officials would have a bigger voice in the nomination.[msnbc]

The Republicans do not have super delegates.[LAT]

How do you become a regular delegate?[LAT]

The rules are different in each state. Generally speaking, you must be registered to vote and a member of a political party to become one of its delegates. In some states, delegates run for election; it is their name you will see on the ballot today next to the candidate they support. In California, Democratic delegates are elected at caucuses in April. On the Republican side, the candidates appoint their delegates.[LAT]

Are delegates bound to support the candidate they pledged to support once they get to the party conventions?[LAT]

Again, the rules vary. On the Republican side, some states require delegates to stick by a candidate for a certain number of ballots. Others don't. On the Democratic side, despite the use of the term "pledged delegates," in reality they are not required to support a particular candidate once they get to the convention, though they are expected to do so.[LAT]

Will today's vote settle the two nominating fights?[LAT]

That was the assumption not long ago. But now it looks less certain, especially on the Democratic side. Any forecast has to be taken advisedly, given the twists the campaign has already seen.[LAT]

Depending on the outcome, Super Tuesday could give McCain a big boost toward securing the GOP nomination. Polls show him running ahead of Romney in some big winner-take-all states, which could significantly pad McCain's delegate count and lengthen the odds that Romney can overtake him.[LAT]

The republicans continue to commit political suicide with the hispanic votres.[trb]

Immigration was a distant second-place issue among Republicans in Georgia, with Mr. Romney winning that slice. Nearly half of Georgia voters said illegal immigrants should be deported rather than allowed to stay as guest workers or as applicants for citizenship. Mr. Romney easily won the deportation crowd over Mr. McCain, who championed a bill that would have allowed for a guest-worker program and for a path to citizenship for those in the U.S. illegally today.

For Democrats, it is hard to envision anything other than a continued fight between Clinton and Obama. The proportional allocation of delegates and the fact both are waging well-financed, strongly competitive campaigns suggests each will walk away today claiming a victory of some sort. That gives both a strong incentive to press on as the race heads into Virginia, Maryland and the District of Columbia for next week's contests on "Chesapeake Tuesday."[LAT]




Posted here by Terry Bankert 2/6/08

-----where did this stuff come from?---
Los Angles Times,1,6056105.story?ctrack=1&cset=true
The Wall Street Journal
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The New York Times
The San Francisco Chronicle
Comments of Terry Bankert


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